I have said for years that the fight to remove Native American-inspired nicknames from sports is the endeavor of a vocal minority of Native Americans. Now a tribe of Sioux in North Dakota is suing to keep the Fighting Sioux nickname at the Univ. of North Dakota.
“When you hear them announce the name at the start of a hockey game, it gives you goose bumps,” said Frank Black Cloud, a tribal member. “They are putting us up on a pinnacle.”
Good for them. And good for the other Native Americans who see the Blackhawks and the Seminoles and the Indians and the Sioux as what they are: A glorification of their ancestors and an honor.
And as I’ve said over and over, if North Dakota wants to become the “Univ. of North Dakota Fighting Queers,” I’ll welcome the recognition!
Of course, the out-of-touch New York Times calls this a “twist” because the P.C. police there truly can’t intellectually understand why any Native American would be against the misguided cause of their comrades looking to undermine the honoring of their ancestors. It’s just unfortunate that the NCAA has been overrun by the same vocal minority.
on Dec 9th, 2009 at 6:27 pm
“Fighting Sioux” is one thing, “Redskins” is another, IMHO. And your quote on the “Fighting Queers” is interestingly optimistic….somehow I think “Screaming Faggots” is what would end up on the jersey. All said tongue-in-cheek, of course.
on Dec 9th, 2009 at 7:40 pm
i don’t think you know much about natives. for one you use ‘native american’ which hardly any body uses.
but before you look to one tribal resonlution, look at how many other lakota and dakota tribes have spoken against the ‘fighting sioux’ nickname. they want to use our name but do they come to our communities? they say they represent us but where are they?
when opposing teams come to play they portray ’sioux’ people in terrible ways. students who go to UND, students who are directly affected by the mascot are part of this ‘vocal minority’ speaking against the ‘fighting sioux’ nickname and mascot. until natives started speaking out against mascots is when universities and colleges started cleaning up their act in how they would portray indian mascots.
when does the majority get to decide what it is that the minority really wants?
on Dec 9th, 2009 at 10:18 pm
Any attempt to use a nickname pertaining to African-American culture would be shot down faster than you can say “gangsta”. As it should be!!! Why should it be any different when dealing with Native American culture? Is it simply because they don’t have the same amount of political power and lobby as African Americans? That’s just wrong in my book.
A common refrain in defending the use of Native American names as nicknames is “we are honoring them by using their name”. I say bull….! I grew up 30 miles from a reservation in North Dakota. The feelings for the native people in my white hometown were anything but respectful and honorable. How is it people can do nothing but talk s..t about them in everyday life yet claim to “honor”them when they want to use their name for their own selfish purpose.
I’m a fan of UND hockey. I’m not a fan of the Fighting S. . . . . Get rid of the name now!!!
on Dec 9th, 2009 at 10:56 pm
Florida State asked the Seminole Nation for permission before adopting “Seminoles” as the school’s nickname. Every Seminole who qualifies academically to get into FSU gets a full ride. Renegade, the horse ridden by “Chief Osceola,” is handled by tribal members. When I was in a campus organization in the seventies, Chief Buffalo Tiger addressed us at length about the special relationship between the FSU Seminoles and the Seminole Nation. One size never fits all.
on Dec 10th, 2009 at 9:46 am
Yep, that’s why the Cleveland Indians have Chief Wahoo. Certainly an honorable depiction of America’s indigenous people. Don’t you think?
Biggest reason they have that logo in ND is because they wouldn’t have gotten their stunningly gorgeous hockey arena built otherwise. Plans were in the works to revert the logo to something more PC until Ralph Engelstad – the man who plunked down a 9 figure sum to build the palace and name it after himself – threatened to stop construction and leave it as a half built shell unless the logo was kept. Then saw to it that the logo was put in so many spots within the venue that it would be virtually impossible to eliminate…..
Yep, all about honor. Isn’t it?
on Dec 10th, 2009 at 2:57 pm
I find it rich when someone outside of a particular group has the gall to tell people of that group what they should and shouldn’t be offended by. For example, I’ve seen homophobes tell gay people that they shouldn’t be offended by the use of words, “faggot,” “fag,” etc. Cyd is doing the same thing with regards to Native American names.
on Dec 10th, 2009 at 5:44 pm
If this particular tribe is okay with the university using a particular nick-name which is specific to them that’s one thing, but I think you’re mistaken if you think there’s a minority of individuals in the Native American community who are against the use of athletic teams using terms to describe Native Americans. Particularly teams that use general terms to describe Native Americans (“Redskins, “Indians,” etc…) as there nickname.
I grew up in AZ (right off of a reservation actually) and most Native Americans I knew preferred NOT to be called “Indians” and several found it offensive, actually. Who exactly is the baseball team in Cleveland “honoring” by calling themselves the “Indians?”
on Dec 10th, 2009 at 11:40 pm
I’m encouraged by the response to this story. I couldn’t possibly agree with Cyd’s position on this one any less and it seems most here seem to agree. If one group of marginalized people can’t understand and support another marginalized group then who can.
on Dec 11th, 2009 at 1:42 pm
No such thing as a case by case basis? If the Sioux do not have a problem with a team calling themselves the Fighting Sioux, why should anyone else? If you have an issue with Redskin or Indian, take it up with the francises in DC and Cleveland. Cyd was referring to the PC police being upset simply because there is no unanimous consensus by Native Americans in regards to native monikers for sports teams. Not everyone thinks the same way, or are offended by the same things. Why would we expect Native tribes to be upset at the same thing? Simply because they are Natives or a minority group?
You cant cry victimization if the group you claim being victimized doesnt go along for the ride.
on Dec 12th, 2009 at 6:44 pm
yeah and only a vocal minority of the gays are calling for gay marriage and that kind of stuff.
if the vocal minority gays will just shut up their mouths then everything will be fine. its the vocal minority gay people who are causing all these trouble.
if other gays will sue the vocal minority to shut up then good for them.
on Dec 12th, 2009 at 8:35 pm
Whaaaaa. . .? Are you kidding me VM? If the “vocal minority” (as you call them and seem to think they are) just “shut their mouth and quit causing trouble” you would still be using a special knock on at a nondescript door to get into a gay bar. Then you would spend the evening hoping the police didn’t show up and hall you away.
Shutting up about issues of civil rights doesn’t solve anything it only perpetuates it. Speaking up doesn’t “cause” the problem it “addresses” the problem. If you want to live in a dark room of denial and you own kind of comfort fine. Just don’t expect everyone else to stand still while the world moves on by.
on Dec 14th, 2009 at 11:20 am
Er… if I’m not mistaken, mplsboy, vocal minority was being sarcastic. He’s comparing Native American issues to gay issues. And in some aspects, they are similar. There is not general agreement for gay marriage, for example, even if many gay rights groups will settle for no less than that.
So one tribe says they’re okay with keeping the Fighting Sioux. But what about the other tribes? One endorsement does not give a university carte blanche to take advantage of a group’s cultural heritage. According to the article, one tribal council (Spirit Lake) supports it while another (Standing Rock) is against it.
I disagree with the position on this article. Making a group of people be a school’s mascot sounds like disaster to me – it flattens the representation of the group into just one attribute, whether it be the savage, “Fighting Sioux”, or the belligerent “Fighting Irish”. And while they’re meant to be positive stereotypes, they project into people’s minds the one fact that Sioux = fighting, instead of thinking about their tribe’s history, culture, and people as their own thing.
on Dec 14th, 2009 at 5:12 pm
Blue Wizard. I agree with you 100%. Well stated!
If VM’s post was intended as sarcasm I stand corrected. However even upon rereading it that’s not apparent to me. Can you confirm VM? I would be very satisfied to know we are all taking the same position.
on Dec 14th, 2009 at 6:44 pm
actually according to the article it wasn’t even spirit lake supporting keeping the mascot but a few tribal members. equating the two is misleading.
on Dec 17th, 2009 at 1:11 pm