So, I’m sitting here, doing something I promised myself not to do –actually watch even so much as a second of the men’s basketball games– and NBC cut away at half-time for an interview with Bob Costas and IOC President Jacques Rogge. If this interview were a sport, Rogge would be on the stand accepting a gold medal, while Costas would already be back at the Olympic village playing video games.
First off, Jim Lampley introduced the segment, while in the background of the shot, Chairman Mao smiled beneficently, which was perfect. The Belgian Rogge then deftly handled Costas’ questions and at one point, actually shut him up, which is quite a feat. I’ll lay my cards on the table here: I think the Chinese human rights and environmental situations are appalling, but non-Chinese nations often appear to be huge hypocrites if it suits their business or geo-political purposes. See: NBC’s parent company General Electric desperately wanting to open the largest untapped market in the world to their products. Think all those GE commercials that litter the online feeds are a coincedence?
Should China have been awarded the Games? On a strictly human rights basis, obviously not, but the IOC is going to do what the IOC is going to do and member nations can’t retroactively complain when the overall body does something that gets bad PR. Chicago is bidding for the 2016 Summer Games and there’s rumblings that the U.S. shouldn’t get them because of the situation in Iraq. It’s a dangerous game to play, that “holier than thou” thing.
At one point, Costas brought up the case of Joey Cheek and asked why didn’t the IOC vehemently protest. Rogge replied that they did, they requested that China overturn the ruling and they were rebuffed. “It’s a sovereign matter” said Rogge, which as the article linked above indicates, is true: Cheek was a private citizen, not part of the U.S. Olympic traveling party in Beijing.
Rogge then played it perfectly, as befits a man used to dealing with people far more cultured and craftier than a lightweight like Bob Costas: he brought up the case of the Cuban baseball team being denied entry in to the U.S. for the World Championship baseball tournament “because of the row between your countries” and the IOC pleading with the State Department to no avail. “We have to respect these decisions”. Cue the sound of crickets from the chair holding Bob Costas.
Then Costas really blundered: he claimed that “some circles” wanted more “emphatic and direct public statements” from the IOC about situations before and during The Games. Rogge: “Yeah, well, that would probably serve their needs”. Ouch! Rogge then went on to remark that after The Games were awarded to China, he spoke with many people familiar with Chinese culture. “There is one Golden Rule: if one is to obtain something in China, you work with quiet diplomacy, you don’t grandstand, you don’t shout, you don’t lambaste, because it’s not going work”.
Classic moment: at the words “you don’t grandstand, you don’t shout”, the shot cut to Costas, who had this blank look on his face that was priceless, akin to an open-mouthed fish about to be gutted. Shorter Bob Costas: “What is this ‘don’t grandstand, don’t shout, don’t lambaste’ that you speak of? My people and I are not familiar with the words you use”. Brilliant. The interview ended shortly after that and I’m going to try and catch the conclusion of the Costas/Rogge interview tomorrow to see if Bob Costas has removed the tire-tracks off his back.
OMG OMG OMG OMG the U.S. basketball team won their gold, but NBC is now showing the coaches of the U.S. Team after the game and one of my supreme lust objects, Steve Wojciechowski, who is looking FINE, is even more gorgeous than in his Duke days. He’s in Beijing as an assistant to U.S. men’s basketball coach Mike Kezyzewski. Um, it suddenly got hot in here…..
By Jim Allen
20 responses so far ↓
1 Horatio // Aug 24, 2008 at 9:23 am
Rogge is absolutely wrong. The baseball team from Cuba DID NOT have a problem with their Visa coming into the USA. What are you talking about? The preliminary phase of the World Classic was in Puerto Rico and the finals were in San Diego and the Cuban team has a visa only to go to Puerto Rico because they thought they will not make it pass the preliminary round; when they didi they were given permission to go to San Diego in 24 hours.
2 canmark // Aug 24, 2008 at 10:04 am
I remember when that Costas-Rogge interview came on…. and I promptly changed the channel. I thought it would be a yawn-fest, with Costas pretending to grill Rogge, and Rogge offering feeble, political doubletalk. But I’m glad that Rogge showed some spunk.
3 RBearSAT // Aug 24, 2008 at 10:16 am
I agree with Rogge on the Joey Cheek issue. It was an issue outside the scope of the IOC agreement. But Rogge once again played the wrong side of diplomacy with the Chinese. Calling the Beijing smog “fog” was a huge blunder on his part (did you forget that little incident). Granted it didn’t turn into the media event we were expecting but that’s for another day when athletes can provide more insight on the conditions in China during the games. Rogge has been failing lately in his role with the IOC. I applauded him for staying with the athletes in the Olympic Village in 2002 but that’s the last time he stayed in the Village. Rogge is turning into another Samaranch and falling back into Olympic elitism. I’m glad he called Costas out on the issues but he’s no saint.
4 BRHSF // Aug 24, 2008 at 11:58 am
Jacques Rogge is about two steps to the left of being a fascist. His criticism of Usain Bolt reeked of neo-colonial arrogance. The sooner the IOC moves away from being dominated by small European countries, the better off we’ll all be.
5 Justin // Aug 24, 2008 at 1:10 pm
I love you. This is exactly what I want to say.
We all know China has a lot of issues, pollutions, human rights, ….. But sports are sports, Sports should not serve the purpose of other dirty games. The games to exploit interests of certain parties.
6 kazoolist // Aug 24, 2008 at 2:45 pm
Rogge hardly schooled Costas.After watching all three segments of the Rogge interviews, my take away was that Rogge is an out of touch bureaucrat, who offered little more than, as canmark described, “feeble, political doubletalk.” Perhaps this was most evident when he refused to even give an opinion as to if softball should be re-instated in 2016.On his raising of Cuba to dismiss China’s not giving Cheek a passport, my understanding is that at that point Rogge was making things up out of whole cloth. No wonder Costas was taken back.China’s abysmal record on human rights is appalling and the IOC should have never awarded them the 2008 games. The fact that Rogge was more willing to be critical of Olympic champion Usain Bolt than he was to be critical of human rights violator China speaks volumes.
7 pug_ster // Aug 24, 2008 at 4:05 pm
I missed 2 of the interviews between Costas and Rogge. I wonder where you can watch them online…? Thanks.
8 Jeanne // Aug 24, 2008 at 4:36 pm
The sooner the IOC moves away from being dominated by small European countries, the better off we’ll all be.
Of course, because the alternatives are so much better - the ueber-capitalistic and imperialistic USA - or the imperialistic and autocratic Russia - or the communistic dictatorship China…
9 Henry Gomez // Aug 24, 2008 at 7:20 pm
Rogge lied about the Cuban visa issue. It was the “World Baseball Classic” not “World Championships” as Rogge said. And the U.S. initially denied the Cuban team visas because money was going to change hands between MLB and Cuba, which is prohibited by current U.S. policy toward Cuba. When Cuba offered to play without the compensation, the visas were granted and the Cuban team was allowed to enter both Puerto Rico and the mainland U.S. Rogge threw that smokescreen out there and of course Costas didn’t challenge him. Weak.
10 Lin Yuan // Aug 24, 2008 at 8:54 pm
I am always so confused about non-Chinese bashing about the human rights in China. First of all, as a Chinese, I and most of Chinese I know do not feel an “appalling human rights violation” in China. Second, if there were “human rights violations” in China as claimed by most Westerners, it sould be our Chinese to judge if they are considered as human rights violations in China and how we should fix them.The current situation that most Westerners like to criticize China from a moral highland in the name of “human rights” is as ironic as non-U.S citizens criticizing the “abortion” and “gay-marriage” policies in U.S.
11 Jeanne // Aug 24, 2008 at 9:35 pm
Second, if there were “human rights violations” in China as claimed by most Westerners, it sould be our Chinese to judge if they are considered as human rights violations in China and how we should fix them.
The killing of the Jews wasn’t considered a human rights violation in Germany, neither was the persecution of communists, homosexuals, social democrats and Sinti and Roma. Does that make it okay? I just don’t get that attitude: “You are not Chinese, you don’t understand.” Well, duh - of course I can’t understand it like someone from China, but does that mean I can’t have an opinion about that? And just because you and the people you know don’t think that human rights are violated (what about free speech, by the way?) - does that qualify you to speak for 1,3 Billion people you have never met? I also highly doubt that those who feel that their rights are violated always have internet.
12 Lin Yuan // Aug 25, 2008 at 2:32 am
The killing of Jews in Germany is a totally different story because millions Jews in the world (majority of Jews) stood up and asked the world for help to save them. Do you see the majority of Chinese crying for help because their “human rights were violated”?Well, I cannot represent 1.3 billion people in China and neither can you. However, at least I can represent the Chinese people I know well and I am speaking of my opinion based on my 20 years living experience in China.What about you? You probably have never been to China or never had a close contact with Chinese people living in China. That’s why the only words you can use are “doubt” or “suspect”. And BTW, what is the source of all your information? BBC, CNN, or just purly from your biased and imaginative “common sense”?
13 bitterblogger // Aug 25, 2008 at 3:44 am
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So much criticism from the West only proves your fear and despair facing China’s economical, political, cultural, military and still ideological might. Do you really care about human rights in China or just the rights of Tibetans? Do you really care about the work conditions of Chinese or just try to keep the jobs for your own expensive and uncompetitive workforce? Do you really wish China to be as democratic and wealthy as your own country so that Chinese can vote democratically to approve an invasion of others and every Chinese can consume the same amount of energy and commodities and produce the same amount of wastes as you do? You will forever find ways to deplore China as long as China is powerful enough to threaten your world leading status.
14 Jim Allen // Aug 25, 2008 at 11:47 am
Well, Bitterblogger sure lives up to his/her name! ^^
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Horatio: Rogge is absolutely wrong. The baseball team from Cuba DID NOT have a problem with their Visa coming into the USA. What are you talking about?
I had zero knowledge of the Cuban baseball team situation, I merely transcribed what was said on the broadcast; I should have moved the first ” mark up further in the sentence. And you make my point perfectly: if Rogge “is absolutely wrong”, then Costas sat there like a lump of flesh and didn’t challenge him, allowed him to spin it. He didn’t need to argue with him, merely say “You have your facts wrong, sir, but let’s move on”. Aas Henry Gomez said: “Rogge threw that smokescreen out there and of course Costas didn’t challenge him. Weak”.
RBearSAT: Calling the Beijing smog “fog” was a huge blunder on his part (did you forget that little incident)
I was writing about a specific interview that took place at midnight on a Saturday, while I was watching events online with the sound off, listening to music –not during the interview, obviously– reading blogs and balancing my checkbook, it’s absurd to expect me to detail everything stupid thing Rogge and Costas have said in the last two weeks, because that wasn’t the point, this specific interview was.
Kazoolist: China’s abysmal record on human rights is appalling and the IOC should have never awarded them the 2008 games.
Right, and General Electric, one of the largest corporations in the world, who paid almost a Billion dollars for the television rights that they’ve held since, what? 1980 at least , who manufacture weapons, refrigerators and tons of other stuff and, oh, own NBC, had no say whatsover in the selection process, that HUGE untapped Chinese market to sell their stuff in played NO part in the awarding decision, oh no siree.
If anyone believes that, I have a Nigerian money scam I’d LOVE to try on them.
Bitterblogger points out the other hypocrisy of the whole “human rights” deal, we in the West sure don’t mind those consumer goods that are afforable because the jobs have fled our countries to China, where they can be made for a fraction of the cost by workers paid less in a week than I make in a day.
Jeanne: Of course, because the alternatives are so much better - the uber-capitalistic and imperialistic USA - or the imperialistic and autocratic Russia - or the communistic dictatorship China…
Jeanne for the win.
Look, I’m 48, I’ve protested, written letters, boycotted crap (see: Coors beer, but that’s easy, it’s buffalo piss anyway) since I was 12 and done all that activist stuff. One thing I’ve learned over the years is that moral compromise ALWAYS plays a part.
Look at Bono and his African debt relief campaign: he had to suck up to that vile cesspit Jesse Helms to get what he wanted because Helms controlled the US part of what he needed. So, there’s that scum Helms, racist homophobe asshole to his dying breath, sitting in a sky box and being served champagne at a U2 gig.
The number of places that can pull off something like the Olympics is small. As FIFA is going to find out in two years, Africa is not the place to hold the football World Cup, because they simply don’t have the infrastructure to pull it off. Oh, how nice if the IOC only held the Games in places where bunnies frolic, the people run free and all is good and light. Oh……wait……there’s no fucking place on earth like that! If the US is awarded the Games in 2016 in Chicago, you can be damn sure that the Iraq war is going to be thrown in our faces every time we criticize another country. Glass houses, stones, that sort of thing.
Please make sure you read Patricia Nell Warren’s piece that’s on the front page of this blog (sorry, it’s 1:00 am on a work night and I can’t figure out how to embed HTML here). She’s dead on with this:
The 1980 and 1984 boycotts over Soviet human rights had accomplished little but setting back a lot of sports careers. What to do?
How about we quit pretending that sports or rock concerts or movie awards ceremonies are venues for meaningful social change? That’d be a start.
15 kawa // Aug 25, 2008 at 6:00 pm
I am afraid most of your preconceived ideas of “appalling human rights record” in China is overblown and exaggerated. It is hyped up, essentially let me tell you this, it is a geopolitical tool, a propaganda.
Most of the media coverage in some Western countries are so tilted against China, from economic, social, and now “philosophical” arena.
It doesnt take a genius to figure out what is happening, when you are constantly bombarded again and again with stories after stories of “human rights violations” after a while you will definitely form a mental picture in your mind that China is a serious evil country and the government violate its people’s human rights.
Unfortunately your medias have gone too far, with supporting ethnic-nationalist-separatist in the name of human rights, supporting a boycott of Olympics in the name of human rights, and even ran stories of seemingly nitpicking, catty, hostile , condescending attitude about Olympic details.
You need to understand for us Chinese people, when you open your mouth to say “human rights” our ears are hearing something else. Because we can see what is your real attitude and your real intention when you are saying it. We can see a condescending, neo-colonialist, “holier-than-thou”, hostile, cultural supremacist, who goes out of his way to insult other people, to find something and nitpick so you can feel good about yourself and think of yourself more highly.
Want to really talk about human rights, ok lets talk. Let me tell you this, there is NO universal definition or implementation of “human rights”. Each country decides for itself what is human rights, and how this rights should be balanced with responsibilities. For you in USA, same-sex marriage can be framed in the theme of human rights. Not in other countries in the world. You can say democracy and voting is human rights, but other countries have kings. You can say waving a separatist flag is a human rights, but in other countries that is deemed seditious or subversive, and not a form of human rights. I can give you another example, in some Western countries questioning Holocoust is deemed as not freedom of speech and people can go to jail or get a fine. But you dont see other countries questioning you, hey, what is that, that is a violation of human rights, violation of freedom, free speech, no, because that is your choice as a society to decide what is good and what is not good, and how rights should be balanced with the overall needs of your society.
So my Western friends, why are you constantly seeing China with a jaded eye and passing negative judgements again and again?
Actually you should be more suspicious of your media coverage, or your own mental workings, because some of that just doesnt make sense.
16 Ted // Aug 25, 2008 at 10:03 pm
>>>>I was writing about a specific interview that took place at midnight on a Saturday, while I was watching events online with the sound off, listening to music –not during the interview, obviously– reading blogs and balancing my checkbook, it’s absurd to expect me to detail everything stupid thing Rogge and Costas have said in the last two weeks, because that wasn’t the point, this specific interview was.<<<<<
If you can’t be bothered to pay attention and get all the details I can’t really be bothered paying attention to your rants.
17 Jim Allen // Aug 26, 2008 at 12:11 am
But you did, Ted, at least one them, you moran! FAIL.
18 Jim Allen // Aug 26, 2008 at 12:31 am
Fuck, always happens, who’s the moran now? “But you did, Ted at least one OF them”. FAIL for Jim Allen too.
RBearSAT tried to ding me for not mentioning something that was said earlier, like I said, it’s absurd to expect me to address that when I was writing about what was said in the interview on Satuday. If I had addressed every stupid thing the two men said in the last two weeks, this would have been a 5,000 word essay.
Kawa brings up some good points and certainly, the US is on very shakey moral ground these days re: lecturing other countries on how to behave. If the 2016 Games are awarded to Chicago, the world is going to have a field day pointing out US wrongdoing(s) (and not just the Bush II term by any means).
At the very least, criticizing China for human rights violations while being more than happy to exploit their cheap, non-union labor on the behalf of large multi-national corporations is inconsistent, at worst it’s blatant hypocrisy.
It’s a funny old world, ain’t it?
19 Lin Yuan // Aug 26, 2008 at 3:00 am
Jim, you see, here is the misunderstanding between people in the West and people in China. Western friends think they are trying to help Chinese to improve their human rights (here I do not mean those who just pretentiously doing so), while Chinese (at least a large portion of them, if I dare to say so) think Westerners are trying to meddle their internal affairs.
Nobody denies that human rights in China need significant improvement. However, people in different culture and at different times have different understanding in human rights. For example, in most developing countries, being able to eat a bread everyday is considered as a much more urgent human right than being able to vote their leaders. Also, due to different cultural and religious backgrounds, some “freedom” may not regarded as “free”. For example, you cannot say women wearing scarf in muslim country is violating human rights; similarly, an atheist cannot simply say that banning of abortion in some states in U.S. is a serious human rights violation.
Just my two cents. My Western friends, if you really want to help other people in the world, please first understand their real needs and respect their choice.
20 Jim Allen // Aug 27, 2008 at 3:34 am
For example, in most developing countries, being able to eat a bread everyday is considered as a much more urgent human right than being able to vote their leaders
Totally agree with that, and the other stuff you wrote.
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